This week’s Jesus Changes Everything Podcast
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RC: I commend you for forcefully stating these truths, and yet in a loving manner. The world does not understand love, truth, discipline, and the connections between them, so boldness stating any biblical truth is often met with condemnation, accusations of rigidity, and even hate. However, it is necessary for God’s people to “speak the truth in love,” especially where fundamental matters are at stake.
DCW
Dear RC Sproul Jnr.,
Regarding your quip, about “Francis in hell”, – you’re God are you, wherein you get to judge who goes to Heaven and hell???
Since the answer to this rhetorical question is quite clearly “no”, why do you arrogate to yourself such a determination?
Whilst we can go on the criteria* that is laid out for us in the “whole” deposit of faith (of which Scripture [and the full 73 Books, not the adulterated 66 Book protestant version] is but “one” source), God alone knows the heart, mind, will and motives of every soul that He alone judges. Period.
* A note to you protestants – such criteria for inheriting eternal life also includes the command that Christ Himself gave us, to eat His Flesh, and drink His Blood (ie. Eucharist), which you either don’t believe, or don’t fulfil – even if you believe you have The Eucharist (which you don’t, since your protestant sects are cut off from Apostolic succession, so don’t have valid priestly orders)… and that’s just one point to consider amongst many others, not the least being the necessity of being a part of His One and Only Church that He established (Catholic Church). Some food for thought…
By now, hopefully it is evident I am Catholic.
Was I a Pope Francis fan? Not really, and his Pontificate did seem to be a bit of a rough ride at times… but he was our Pope (unless a succeeding Pope – or Christ Himself – draws a line through the last 12+ years).
Does Pope Francis have to face the Judgement now?
Absolutely… as we “all” ultimately will, eventually.
Are there certain requisites to get to Heaven?
Yes… and that also includes the exhortation that Christ expounded over and over again, as noted above (and of which protestants twist, if not flat-out ignore), which we find recorded in the Gospel of St. John.
However, do “you” (or “I”, or “anyone else”) get to determine his judgement (or anyone else’s)?
No.
We need to prepare ourselves as best as possible, prepare and evangelise others as best as possible, and when those around us depart this earthly life, we leave Judgement in the Hands of Almighty God (which is what I also do with protestants), Who Alone searches the mind and heart, and awards accordingly (Jer. 17:10).
We all get to be judged at the end of time, and Pope Francis will probably get judged more severely, given his position (as we read in the Gospel of St. Luke 12:48).
I pray for your conversion to the ONE Church Christ established.
He has but ONE Bride – He “ain’t” a polygamist, with 30,000+ (and counting) protestant so-called “brides”!
Now I’ve gotten that off my chest, it’s a pity comments for a previous article you put forth a couple of years ago were closed, ie. “Rome not Home”, wherein you seem to claim that so many of your protestant peers that have “swum the Tiber” and converted to Catholicism, did so simply on the premise of “… the appeal of ancient history and ancient liturgy… the appeal of the relative intellectual vigor”. No, I’d venture to say it had a bit more to do with than just that.
That appeal may indeed be present, but Catholicism is ultimately also where the truth lays – inconvenient truth to hard-line protestants like yourself, perhaps?
At any rate, whether such truth is inconvenient or not, a certain famous Figure made a pertinent point about the truth setting us free (John 8:31-32).
Further, your attempts at seeming to try to make Rome’s appeal to it’s own authority like some kind of circular reasoning, is pretty lame.
It’s often for the sake of “sola Scriptura” protestants like yourself that Scriptural references are made (eg. Matt: 16-19). Scripture records the events that actually took place, including Christ investing authority to St. Peter, promising that He would be with His Church always, and that the gates of hell would not prevail against His Church.
Will leave at this for now.
Praying for your conversion to Christ’s One and Only Church before your own passing from this life.
Pax Christi,
Michael.
Michael, while I doubt we will settle the question of the Reformation, I do think it would be a help to you if I point out an inconsistency in your comment. You begin by rebuking me for thinking myself God, getting to judge who goes to heaven or hell. You end by praying for my conversion before my death. Can you see that the latter, at the very least, implies I will go to hell if I do not become Roman Catholic? That you are, by your own standard, thinking yourself God, getting to judge who goes to heaven or hell? You are conflating two different uses of judge. One is making the decision, which we both agree God does, not me, not you and certainly not the church. The second is an estimation of what we believe God has revealed about the standard by which He decides. My suggesting, barring a last minute conversion, that Francis is in hell, is, even if I’m wrong, no more arrogant than you, or the Council of Trent, suggesting that barring a conversion in me, I will go to hell at death. I’m sorry for your loss.
RC,
First of all, it would be difficult to “settle” on the question of the “Reformation” (“deformation”), as long as you view the Catholic Church through biased protestant lens.
* On this point, however, I find it curious as to how(/why) you didn’t attend to the points I made about Christ’s exhortation (which He repeated multiple times) about the NEED to (ie. “unless you…”) literally, physically eat and partake of His Body and Blood (which can only be done through The Eucharist), to inherit Eternal Life… not to mention Christ’s institution of His “One and Only Church”, established on St. Peter, of which we all need to be a part… as a couple of preliminary responsorial remarks.
This is what protestants simply ignore – and simply don’t have… and “can’t” have within protestant sects that are cut off from Apostolic succession… and simply can’t be ignored or wished away through inconvenience.
Moving on to your other points…
You will actually see that there’s no inconsistency within my comments, if you read them carefully, in full, and in context.
I’ll copy/paste a pertinent part for you, “… we leave Judgement in the Hands of Almighty God (which is what I also do with protestants), Who Alone searches the mind and heart, and awards accordingly (Jer. 17:10).”
Note the part in brackets, ie. “which is what I also do with protestants”.
This still fits harmoniously with the rest of my points.
First of all – yes, it is indeed necessary to be Catholic.
Before I press on, for some reason, protestants often preface that with “Roman”, ie. “Roman Catholic” (or often simply abbreviated by protestants as RC… your initials, btw, lol!) – which is something that needs to be cleared up.
“Roman Catholicism” is within the Western “lung” of The Catholic Church – and there are a few different Western rites.
There are also multiple “Eastern rites” – in fact 23 of them.
“Roman” Catholicism is by the far the largest rite over-all, but it’s by no means the “only” rite. All the other rites are fully Catholic as well.
Without labouring the point, you might find this link handy: https://media.ascensionpress.com/2019/01/21/the-other-23-catholic-churches-and-why-they-exist/
Ok, so moving on (again)…
So, yes, it is indeed necessary to be Catholic, since The Catholic Church is “The” One and Only Church Christ established. Again, Christ has but “One” Bride, and we can’t just make up other (so-called) “brides”, according to whim, or personal judgement.
Come Judgement Day, any protestants that remained protestant, will be Judged by Almighty God, Who Alone can search the soul and heart of all.
He Alone can determine if you had enough knowledge and good-will to know to enter and be a part of His Catholic Church.
Given our little dialog here – as well as the capacity for you to humble yourself and learn more, whilst you still have time – this is the kind of thing He will Judge you (and other protestants) on, in this regard.
So, I hope you can see that there is no “inconsistency” in my comments, when read in full, and in context.
Nor is there “conflation” between different usages of “judging”.
Rather, when read in full and in context, my points harmonise.
You also state, “… and certainly not the church”, as though The (presumably Catholic) Church has no Authority – this claim is absurd, when made against The Catholic Church.
That claim can certainly be made against protestant “churches”, but not against The Catholic Church, since She “has” been vested with Christ’s Authority.
We such Authority being delegated to St. Peter (who is delegated the highest authority on earth) in Matt. 16:19:
“… and I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven”
… as well as to the other Apostles (who are given a limited “share” in authority), later in this same Gospel – Matt. 18:18:
“I promise you, all that you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and all that you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven”.
I also don’t know why you limit yourself to the Council of Trent (which is something I’ve often found with protestants), which was but one of many Authoritative Church Councils in the last 2 millenia.
Wrapping and summing up.
Christ gave us “One Church”. He Died for This One Church.
He didn’t say (as recorded in Holy Writ – eg. Gospel according to St. Matthew):
“… thou art Peter, and upon this Rock, I will build My Church… but it won’t take long to crumble. However, don’t stress, because in about a millenia and half, “true reformers” will come along, like Calvin, Knox and Luther…”
No.
He established This One Church, with His Promise, that “… the gates of hell shall not prevail against It”.
So, you must decide if you are more interested in viewing The Catholic Church through distorted and biases lens, or if you are big enough, open enough, and honest enough to read past the errors of Her many members over the course of history, and see that She still is (and only She can be) the Only Church Christ Himself established.
Put differently – is ignorance more blissful for you, and/or are you more interested in the fame your late father built up (sorry for your loss of him a few years ago – hope he converted as well prior to death), and would keeping his flame alive be more important than the “whole” truth?
Truth (as inconvenient as it may be at times), or selective/convenient “truths”… there’s a choice to be made, the response to which, will take you in vastly different directions… which may take a fair dose of humility, dashing false pre-conceived notions, swallowing (or, rather, “spitting out”) pride, and perhaps even crushing a bit of built-up ego… what’s it to be?
Have a great day.
Pax Christi,
Michael.